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Jul 01, 2014

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Lydia

I have to agree with Mike's suggestion there are cult like tendancies with Mars Hill. You know this is true when you read the "Ilovemarshill" website. They are stories written by former members some of which is are bone chilling. Like the ones coming out about Demon trials. Sex problem? A demon. Mars Hill in one story: YOu can only give 40 bucks a month to church? Go on food stamps.

The cult part comes from the fact these stories of their "church" experience are on a site called "I love Mars Hill" written by former members ands staffers.

I will be less worried for their healing when they cease to love Mars Hill. Love Jesus instead. Safer.

From porno divinations to demon trials, to shunning to plagurism to authoritarianism.....you have to wonder how any Acts 29 pastors trained by Driscoll the SBC has helped fund and how many people we have caused problems for as a result.

It was not long ago a popular SBC pastors blog was defending him to the hilt: He preaches the Gospel. Well it sorta does not count when it is offered up with vats of poison.

Joshua David Kelso

"I want to apologize to the people of different sexual orientation who have felt the weight of judgement."

Please don't take this as being supportive or defensive of Driscoll, but the above quote is one example of serveral times in the article where I really wondered if Anderson really ever spent much time actually studying, understanding and applying God's Word.

I perceive that one of the main dangers of a Mars Hill style church is that "discipleship in following Christ and spreading his message" can morph into "grooming to follow the party line and spreading their message".

I hope he finds a good church.

Alex Guggenheim

Having read the article a number of things stood out:

The author was a victim of himself, first and foremost. He takes some responsibility for this, though. It should temper his perspective a bit more. Possibly, his being so willingly sycophantic has caused him to enlarge the culpability of others.

Tim Keller's response (as the author recalls) to the casual and friendly introduction the author gave to Keller was pompous and rather self-patronizing. Yes, we know the "resurgence won't be directed", Mr. Keller but he (the author) was talking ministry duties and you knew that but no, you had to take it out of context so you could retort with a belittling and self-serving comment which enlarged you and minimized him in a disingenuous manner. UGH.

The author does a good job in the brevity of the article of outlining the general power grab by men as opposed to ministry enlargement by God. And he has some good supporting materials in the links.

The quote he provides of Mark Driscoll confiding his competitiveness in a sermon is really a "what you see is what you get" situation that has existed since Driscoll showed up on the radar. And as referenced, some people saw this early in Driscoll's ministry, warned about it.

There really is no mystery. He sees the ministry as a legitimate place for personal ambition and competition. Of course the Bible rejects this concept though many men attempt to sanctify such motivations while using the ministry as a vehicle for personal enterprise, ambition and competition.

With whom is he competing? Jesus, other ministers? He should be serving, ministering. "What is it to thee, follow thou me".

He may have the spiritual gift of teaching, thus, it is reasonable that many believers are attracted to him. However, this is far short of what the Bible requires for our allegiance to a ministry and Minister and even then that allegiance is both tempered by a description of a well-vetted teacher and limited by the boundaries of Scripture with our over-arching devotion to Christ.

Ultimately, however, the author still comes across as lacking maturity. I am glad he is waking up to some needed attendance with regard to a healthy perspective, but what is unsettling is his still and constant crusader-like mentality which got him in trouble in the first place. Now his crusade is again Mark Driscoll. He was once the propaganda Minister for and today, against.

I suggest that he take much longer for some introspection and maturity which will allow him to comment, more forcefully, on unhealthy ministries. He is still too personally attached.

CASEY

many of us having been waving "warning flags" for years....but let's turn our eyes and efforts to those SBC leaders who still continue to drink this Kool-Aid.....the president of Southeastern Seminary who when asked about a spiritual/sin problem and defers to collegiality rather than what the Bible says(SBC-Baltimore-June 2014)....years ago a 'trigger' of how bad things were in the SBC was this office helped deicate a brewery....seems like we're repeating history again....past time for CONSERVATIVE RESURGENCE 2.......

Max

When Driscoll falls from his throne (and he will), there will be unfortunate collateral damage within SBC ranks. Pride cometh before a fall ... and they don't come any more arrogant than Driscoll!

The YRR distanced themselves from Rob Bell faster than the speed of light! Many who now identify with “resurgent” were “emergent” not too long ago, cutting their eye-teeth on Bell’s books and Nooma videos (I find them all over my area in yard sales now). On their way from emergent to resurgent, Driscoll's New Calvinist message and methodology got their attention. He definitely is one of the king pens in the reformed movement. While "cult" might not be the best descriptor of Driscoll's ministry, it's a close cousin.

I continue to be amazed that any SBC leader would support and promote Driscoll. The sad thing is when idols fall (most do), folks get hurt in the aftermath. In this case, many Southern Baptist youth are counted among Driscoll’s following, countless NAMB church planters look up to him, and SBC pastors even serve on his Acts 29 team!

Lydia

"Ultimately, however, the author still comes across as lacking maturity. I am glad he is waking up to some needed attendance with regard to a healthy perspective, but what is unsettling is his still and constant crusader-like mentality which got him in trouble in the first place. Now his crusade is again Mark Driscoll. He was once the propaganda Minister for and today, against. "

Since he spent time in the Mars Hill bubble from age 18-28, the "experience" years for mature adulthood, waiting could be a problem. He has to relearn everything and that takes an enormous amount of time when coming out of cultish groups. I saw the trajectory of this just reading SGM survivors for a few years. They simply do not know how to think independently. There were indoctrinated.

What struck me was his wanting to apologize for his part in it all. And unfortuanately right now the stories are important no matter how badly told or the wrong perspectives given. I am glad he wrote and hope others there will read it and rethink what they are doing there. Perhaps that is why he spoke up.

Often when you leave these types of position and the leader you suffer financially so speaking up is also courageous for some because of the power these celebs hold in so many areas. They can actually hurt chances for high wage jobs as they tend to be well connected in communities.

One thing I have noticed about those coming out of these seemingly Christian cultic systems like SGm, Mars Hill, IFB, Gothard and others is that they tend to do a 180 in beliefs. Thinking that the opposite of what they believed must be right. If they were right wing they become left wing, and so on. It is just more non thinking. They have to learn how to think for themselves.

This sounds crass but there is going to be some money made in this country off spritual abuse. It is rampent because of the rise of cult of personality/authoritarianism in Christendom and the march toward collectivist/oligarchal thinking in this country. A recipe for disaster.

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