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Mar 11, 2012

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Bruce Oyen

Peter, this is a very sad commentary on Liberty University. It went down the road of compromise a long time ago. Their guiding principle seems to be pragmatism. So, if something helps their church and schools get bigger, it must be good. Thanks for documenting this serious departure from Biblical principles. And may God help us all to avoid the curse of pragmatism.

CASEY

Bruce:
I understand your comments of "pragmatism"....but I'm really wrestling with the idea that if the parents of the LU students know this...that they'll remain silent or keep their kids in a 'declining school'. After all, LU was establish "to be different"...to uphold holiness...to be an odd and peculiar people...at a time when the SBC was riddled with liberalism in their colleges and seminaries. Has the LU leadership and its trustees not seen the folly of this path? Perhaps it's time we notified the parents of LU students who are, in fact, funding this perverted entertainment at LU.

Bruce Oyen

Casey, you have valid points. Hopefully many other bloggers and magazines have done, or will do, what Peter Lumpkins has done by getting this information out to the public. If memory serves me well, the official SBC website had a warning about Driscoll's language a couple years ago. FYI, I'm not a Southern Baptist. I'm a member of the Independent Fundamental Churches Of America, International, and I pastor an independent Baptist church.

lmalone

Anyone see what I mean about the "inverse" leadership that is taking place? The supposed wise grey heads are following the prompts of the young guys to stay "relevant and cool" and keep the numbers up. It is amazing. I am seeing it everywhere.

It is pragmatism at it's worst.

Max

lmalone writes “Anyone see what I mean about the "inverse" leadership that is taking place?”

Yep! I see it clearly from my vantage point overlooking a reformed corner of the SBC landscape. In my area, several SBC church plants are essentially large youth groups with immature Dricollites running things! SBC "leaders” who support the YRR movement appear to be bowing to popular influencers within and without SBC ranks by promoting whoever and whatever is drawing a crowd (e.g., Driscoll and his message). The old guys shout to the young guys “Tell me which way you want to go, and I’ll get out in front to lead!” It is this pragmatism – the moving of boundaries for the sake of numbers and cultural relevance - which will cause the whole denomination to eventually slip into an uncertain future. Yep, some of us see it … but is anyone listening?

Hobart M. Tucker

I wonder if Bott Radio would be interested in covering this controversy? Didn't he cancel a show mid-segment to avoid having Driscoll appear on his network? Also, what is the position of Salem Radio, American Family Association, Focus on the Family? Who has enough influence to intervene with LU? Does anyone have contact information (email) for Johnnie Moore?

BTW, Imalone, I think the Scripture reference you're recalling is Isaiah 3:4 "I will give children to be their princes, And babes shall rule over them."

Hobart M. Tucker

The tumult in the SBC seems to reflect the Rehoboam Syndrome described in 1 Kings 12:8.

What is befuddling is it seems to start with Jimmy Draper?!

Kim

Peter,
Just had a chance to see the two videos in the other post. I have had many problems with mark driscoll for years. From the twisting of song of Solomon, seeing sex acts in the words of that book he says we are to do, to his over all obsession with sex in everything.

But when I heard about his visions a few months back, and then saw them next to the snake handlers, scary! My mother-in-law years ago was caught up in the Kansas city prophets, John wimber, mike bickle stuff. They taught her too, that she could see visions like they could. The leadership was always telling her of visions they had of us, her family members. We had real struggles with her in this movement. It got worse when she went to the Toronto blessing that went on.

Not to go on and on, but my point is, we knew this wasn't right. The many books and warnings that came out about this stuff was numerous. Why can mark Driscoll do some of the same, and it's ok? They think his doctrine is ok so anything goes? Doesn't his visions, sex talk, twisting of scripture, etc. show that it's not all ok? Just saying.

lmalone

"Why can mark Driscoll do some of the same, and it's ok? They think his doctrine is ok so anything goes? Doesn't his visions, sex talk, twisting of scripture, etc. show that it's not all ok? Just saying"

Kim, it is not just this but the support of CJ Mahaney by Mohler is also chilling. Mahaney grew the shepherding cult People of Destiny to SGM. Most people do not know that the "prophecy mic" was a normal method until a few years ago when CJ was trying to be accepted by the celebrities. CJ called himsself an "Apostle". The horror stories coming out of those who have fled sound like cult brainwashing including teaching pastors to ignore physical abuse and sexual abuse of children by telling them to counssel to forgive and NOT call the authorities! Yet Mohler says that those relating these many many horror stories just "do not like strong leadership".

Now we have Mahaney moving to Kentucky! We have his son in law (former SGM pastor) going to SBTS and his wife working there!

And best of all, CJ "mentored" Driscoll a few years back supposedly to make him "accountable".

This is where the SBC is going. From Driscoll and Acts 29 to Mahaney/SGM. This is where Mohler/Akin and others in leadership are leading us. It is one reason they have to seal documents and try to change the name. They are going somewhere most of us would never dare to go as members of the Holy Priesthood who love truth and do not follow man but our Savior.

Simon Lam

"Mark Driscoll showing up on campus at Liberty University may be one of the most shocking events within evangelicalism thus far in the 21st century."

*facepalm*

You cannot be serious, Pete.

lmalone

http://joyfulexiles.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/jonna-mhc-story-29.pdf

One more reason why we must put a stop to funding Acts29. Site is by a former elder of MH who finally decided to tell what happened to him and being fired.

http://joyfulexiles.com/

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