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Jan 19, 2012

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Kevin

That was bad. Real bad. I cannot believe that passes as a sermon. What in the world. I don't believe the Bible prohibits alcohol consumption (when it's lawful), but I do believe it's clear about teachers and their responsibilities. James 3:1 comes to mind.

volfan007

God forbid that one, or more, of his teens dies due to drunk driving now...or, due to alcohol poisoning. What I want to know, is will Brad Cooper show up at the funeral home to apologize to the parent/parents for leading thier children down this path? Or, will he be a coward, and not show up at the funeral?

David

Max

Puts a whole new spin on total depravity. May God lead those youth to a healthier church in their area, where flesh and immaturity is not allowed to take the platform.

And if this wasn't bad enough, it looks like their parents are getting ready to experience Driscoll in a "Real Marriage" conference at NewSpring ... http://www.bradcooper.us/

God help us - the foundations are being destroyed.

Tim G

Where does the Bible say that alcohol will be in heaven? The process of the "making of alcohol" does not coincide with the principles found in scripture that describe heaven - no decay etc...!

Wow!

Debbie Kaufman

This is another point of concern. Although according to sources I've talked to,they say that NewSpring is no longer SBC supported. Can you find out if that is true? The person I talked to said that there was a not to friendly meeting with Perry Noble who even offered to give back SBC monies given him with interest. I said I would have taken him up on that offer. :)

Stuart Houston

Peter,

Thank you for addressing this. Absolutely heartbreaking, misguided, misinformed and tragic. There is no justification for this type of irresponsible, shock "preaching". My heart breaks as I hear the teenagers cheer in the background...

Stuart Houston

Mary

Debbie, be very careful, you've been flirting with the dark side :)

Debbie Kaufman

Mary: I am against anything that calls itself a church, but having listened to the sermons, or snippets of sermons is more of a stand up comic entertainment,abuses the congregation with a bunch of rules I don't understand, says children under 12 cannot come into the sanctuary because of PG 13 sermons(which why PG 13 sermons if they are supposedly from the Bible) and points to what their numbers are more than they point to Christ.

I was shown a link where Perry Noble gave a sermon on Christ the only way, and it was really good. Really, really good.If Perry preached like this all the time, I wouldn't be saying a thing.

But as the clip above shows, this isn't the normal style of preaching. Perry Noble can take any scripture in the Bible, and turn it around to have the Bible speak about them and their building multi million dollar buildings or any number of things for that they did or are going to do. Not a whole lot of theology.

They also joke a lot about smoking crack, doing drugs, which I find more glorifying to drugs than Christ. I could go on and on. It's wrong, it's blasphemous, it's crazy, it's doing anything to get the 100,000 members or 400,000 but it's not reaching them with the Christ of the Bible.

Now I think heaven is going to be a lot different than what we have been told for years. And streets of gold along with jeweled mansions don't ever do a lot for me. Seeing Christ, being with Christ daily. Seeing so many of the Saints there and actually talking to them. That will be heaven for me.

Bill Pfister

Debbie menioned whether or not NewSpring was SBC supported. They were listed in the Baptist Courier last year as an SBC church and they topped the list of churches with the most baptisms in SC. I don't know how much they give but I think the minimum is only $200 a year to be considered SBC.

Tim asked about alcohol in heaven. I think the reference must be to the marriage supper of the Lamb. After the Lord's Supper He says He will not drink it again until He drinks with us in the Kingdom. (Matt 26:29)

I think the way the youth pastor handled this situation very irresponsible and a perfect illustration of how so many churches today are trying to build "big" churches by entertainment. I agree with Stuart: it is heartbreaking, misguided, misinformed and tragic. I also agree with Kevin, teachers need to be responsible.

My God help us to be centered on Christ and the cross!

Bill Pfister
Taylors, SC

Tommy Mann

How truly sad! As a Pastor of Students in the SBC, let me remind my brothers in student ministry: when we stand before Jesus He will not ask us how much we entertained His children, but what we taught them from Scripture. These kids are looking for something to sell out for, and if pizza and games are the best we have then we will lose this generation. Preach the Word!

Max

I think Jesus had something more spiritual in mind in Matthew 26:29 than a high-five alcohol party in heaven! Mr. Cooper obviously didn't catch that.

Jody

Speechless...I'd need an entire blog post to describe what I hate about this clip. This seems in line with what I've seen from this church. I discovered Perry Noble through YouTube and he quickly became one of a small handful of what seem to be influential preachers who literally make me grieve each time I hear them. If memory serves correctly, i believe this is the church who had their band perform AC/DC's "Highway to Hell" in a church service. But hey, lighten up people, the sermon was about hell, so it's appropriate.

Mary

Debbie, I was teasing.

I don't know anything about Noble or his church, but he sounds like another person who thinks the gospel needs the help of cultural relevance.

Barry Bishop

Peter,
just wanted to mention something you might be interested in. There is a set of DVDs called "the Elephant Room - Round 1" where Driscoll and Perry Noble appears with other pastors and answers tough questions about ministry and philosophy. Two other Baptists appear on the panel, namely, David Platt and Matt Chandler. Anyways, I mention this because on it gives insight into some of the guys you've mentioned on the blog using their own words.
I think there are some video and audio clips free on the web from the Elephant Room if you wanting to get idea of the dialogue before plunking down money for the set.

Jake Bull

Peter,

I'm a Student Pastor in Knoxville, TN. I am continually amazed at what happens in "church". I'm shocked at the words that are used and the completely out of control rhetoric that is used. I'm completely aware that there are a lot of youth and student pastors like myself out there. But none of those guys are promoted. None of those guys are found to be important, effective, or valuable.

Apparently something changed. Something must have happened. It's no longer enough to preach and teach that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin, lived a perfect life without sin, died on the cross to pay my sin debt, rose from the dead three days later, is now seated at the right hand of the Father, and will one day return to take His bride to Heaven.

That used to be enough. It used to be all we needed. Once upon a time, the Bible was enough. It wasn't the Bible plus anything else. We need men of God who will stand boldly and unapologetically and preach the Gospel. Nothing else! Nothing less! God help those students who have been fed lies by a man that most of them probably look up to.

There are guys out there who are still doing ministry the right way. I'm praying for you! We need you. Those students need you! Keep preaching the gospel! It's enough!

Stuart Houston

Thank you Tommy Mann and Jake Bull. May your tribe increase.
Stuart Houston

lmalone

This is what I mean when I call out shock jock celebrity preachers. This is about garnering followers and has nothing at all to do with making disciples of Christ. Only followers of men.

They snuck in to the body, folks, and are leading people astray with another Gospel.

Let's make sure we make it clear anytime we can, this is not the truth...but a lie from the pit of hell by a false teacher.

selahV

Peter:
Indeed, "...it's hard to imagine how parents could allow their children to remain under such irresponsible teaching." I dare say it is because they simply have no problem with it. Many offer drinks to their children, feed their friends alcohol in their homes, and "Amen" the preachers calling for moderation.

Even more appalling to me is the pastor who allows one to stand in his pulpit and spew such nonsense knowing the standard to which God has set for shepherds in charge of the sheep!

I am going through and excruciating personal experience with a loved one who is under age and following the example of adult Christians erecting unwise, and questionable stumbling blocks. The brain is not fully able to reason and understand the consequences of his/her actions or filter the information with the depth of knowledge needed to make wise decisions doesn't occur until he/she is in early to mid-twenties.

Feeding this fodder to vulnerable minds is sinful. Plain and simple. Examples set are examples followed.

I am so saddened by this. So very very saddened. Especially given the heartbreak in my own life with the struggle I see going on the multiple lives of those I love at the moment due to alcohol consumption. May God grant us peace and wisdom and grace in these turbulent times. I know it only gets worse till our Savior returns. selahV

CASEY

In most respects...are we really surprised? When you have a President at SEBTS supporting a chapel speaker who supports drinking, R-rated movies, "hottie" nights, anal sex, and a host of other unChristian activities(diversions) from the true Gospel...and a President at SBTS who allows his profs(under the liberal guise of academic freedom) to teach at this same chapel speaker's school for pastors....Is it any surprise that we're starting to reap what these leaders have sown? Again, get your hotel reservations in for the SHOWDOWN at NEW ORLEANS!!! Will the SBC Godly men and women 'stand up' in NEW ORLEANS this June('12)? I trust and believe they will...

Belinda

Hello everyone:)
I've actually been to NewSpring Church before. Yes, the main campus in Anderson where Perry Noble does preach live. Before anyone reads what I have to say, I have a question for you all. Have you ever attended NewSpring Church? If your answer is no.. Then I suggest you to stop reading this. Because how can you have an opinion when you didn't experience it first hand. And if your basing your information on this 3 minute video of their Fuse(youth) ministry....you should take a look at their website.. www.newspring.cc and really see what their Church is about.

NewSpring has been in a series called "party" for a few weeks now. The reason behind that name is because they believe if anyone should celebrate and have so much fun doing it, it should be CHRISTians. ********Because we have a reason to celebrate, JESUS.********So that's why Brad Cooper is preaching about having a party.. So theres where I'm sure a lot of you guys didnt know or understand. Again, only if you know NewSpring first hand...

Second, your taking that statement totally wrong...
"And, I'll go so far as to say to a bunch of under-aged kids: The only place there is going to be alcohol in all of eternity is going to be in heaven. We know this from the Bible..."

I'll go so far meaning I shouldnt say this....
Under-aged meaning not of age....
So Brad is actually saying the exact opposite of what you think he is saying... Not for teenagers drinking

And this really is totally way out of the meaning of Brad Cooper stated...
"After all, one could reasonably infer, if God is going to provide it eternally in heaven, what could be wrong about getting one's fill right here on earth?"

Brad Cooper did not in anyway state that it's okay for teenagers to drink.. AT ALL!

I agree it's not biblical and Brad didn't say that it was okay in this video. I'm sure if you just contact him, he would not be okay with Teenagers drinking.
Matthew 18:15

"If your brother sins go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother."


Your right NewSpring Church is one of the fastest growing Churches. And you know Satan hates that, I mean Satan even used the religious people to crucified JESUS... And I hear so much negative statements about NewSpring when they are all about JESUS.

Why are so many CHRISTians judging and putting down other Churches now a days? JESUS wants us to love each other and pray for them..

He is not a false teacher, He preaches the that JESUS is the only way. & we all know that's the truth.

Carol

Don't come down off the wall, there is more work to do.

lmalone

I've actually been to NewSpring Church before. Yes, the main campus in Anderson where Perry Noble does preach live. Before anyone reads what I have to say, I have a question for you all. Have you ever attended NewSpring Church? If your answer is no.. Then I suggest you to stop reading this. Because how can you have an opinion when you didn't experience it first hand. And if your basing your information on this 3 minute video of their Fuse(youth) ministry....you should take a look at their website.. www.newspring.cc and really see what their Church is about."

Belinda, I have never met Bill Clinton in person but I can tell you I have enough first hand information listening to him and watching him to know I totally disagree with him.

I have been following New Spring since about 2006 when Jim Bulbitz over at Old Truth started analyzing Perry's false teaching and bizarre behavior. It has simply gotten progressively worse since then. And I am saddened you think what is going on there is of Christ. But I am seasoned enough to know it is a waste of time to tell you that.

Karen McCrary

I have never been to a service at New Spring, nor do I have any intention to go to one. But, I have watched and listened (sometimes in shock) to the sermon videos available on New Spring's site. I will not apologize for my convictions, or back down from the truth. Anyone, regardless of which 'side' they are on can debate this subject all day long. But, if you really want the absolute truth...........then simply open your Bible. Brad Cooper's message is wrong....dead wrong! Now, you can argue that he 'slipped up', or that I did not get the 'full message', or the whole 'everything in moderation' speech. Let me save you the argument by saying this. We are human, and yes, even the most Godly preachers of the Word make mistakes. But this is a FUNDAMENTAL difference in doctrine. I do not care to hear that your child would never go to church before New Spring came along, or that New Spring does so much for the children in Africa and boasts membership of 14K plus. IF your child, the African children, or your masses are getting false doctrine, then no amount of justification matters. Christians, please know what you believe, have conviction to say what you believe, and never back down from the Word of truth. We are supposed to live different from the world, and not allow our brother to stumble. That is simply what I would like to see and hear from a church.

Belinda

I just finished watching NewSpring online:) Perry Noble announced that it is "wrong to get drunk". Which is what this whole conversation is about.. And He was not only talking to the teenagers that attend the Church, he was talking to the whole Church. And if you don't believe me watch the service on their website yourself... www.newspring.cc/watchandlisten It uploads Tuesday...
The newest video.. "all in week 3"

This really bothers me..
"I do not care to hear that your child would never go to church before New Spring came along,"
NewSpring preaches the Gossip! JESUS is the only way to GOD. That's what they preach, and it's not false teaching. I don't go to NewSpring any longer but that's where GOD first called my name. My salvation first begun there. If you're calling NewSpring a false Church then you're calling everyone that accepted JESUS as their SAVIOR there that basically they're not really saved. I know you're wrong there.

Max

Karen McCrary ... A huge AMEN just shouted from my spirit as I read your post! There is no doubt that youth and 20s-30s are flocking to young, restless and reformed gatherings. This new breed of young SBC preachers is serving up what the generation wants ... a carnal, fleshly package that is designed to drag as much world into their ministries as possible and still appear Christian. These works are essentially sub-cultures of the world, rather than counter-culture. Woe be unto these pastors and teachers for the distorted message they are delivering to attract and influence young minds under their watch.

Chad

This is what the Bible talks about " A great fallen away". People feel no wrong in their sin at this so called church. There will be no partying in hell only wailing and gnashing and burning forever!

Max

“So I tell you this, and insist on it in the Lord, that you must no longer live as the Gentiles do, in the futility of their thinking … That is not the way of life you learned when you heard about Christ and were taught in him in accordance with the truth that is in Jesus. You were taught, with regard to your former way of life, to put off your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires; to be made new in the attitude of your minds; and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness … do not give the devil a foothold … do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths … do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God.” (Ephesians 4:17-30)

sal

Remember, Jesus is relvant for every generation but He does not change for every generation...I'm sad that we have to make Jesus a common party animal so that people will be drawn to Him...and by the way, alcohol is a product of decay ...whatever we drink in heaven will not make us crazy and will not be a product of death and decay. And by the way, everything old is not bad ( i.e. water, air, faith, hope, love) People are stilled saved the by giving their lives to Jesus by grace through faith...You don't have to try to improve on that because you can't.

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